“Forever Single & Happy” occurs at age….
“Forever Single & Happy” occurs at age….
Post by Older Bachelor on Dec 5, 2004, 1:43pm
I have 2 close male friends that I have both known for over 10 years and they are 52 and 45. Never married, no kids. We talk once in awhile about our situation and let me tell you the consensus: Once a man hits a certain age without marrying and having kids, you get used to your life the way it is and start to lose interest in the whole thing. It seems to me this “Crossing the Threshold of Confirmed Bachelorhood” age is about 41-45. The odds of a man marrying the first time after 45 are less than 5% (US Census 2000). Only an exceptional woman could get me to marry, and I think this is true for my two friends also (At least for one. My friend B is uniquely hard-core about this issue and is so commitment-phobic that he cannot even tolerate having a girlfriend). You get used to the solitude, the flings, and especially the freedom to do as you wish. Putting up with a woman telling you what to do and when to do it gets harder and harder as you age, as your sex drive starts to drop and the “Primary Weapon to Get a Man to do What I What” (sex) gets less effective. I think once you get about 45 and are a hardened bachelor you just don’t want to put up with their crap anymore for a little action. So, other than maybe a fling now and then that isn’t too much work, you don’t want to deal with females on a full-time basis any longer.
“If a young man gets married, starts a family, and spends the rest of his life working at a soul-destroying job, he is held up as an example of virtue and responsibility. The other type of man, living only for himself, working only for himself, doing first one thing and then another simply because he enjoys it and because he has to keep only himself, sleeping where and when he wants, and facing woman when he meets her, on equal terms and not as one of a million slaves, is rejected by society. The free, unshackled man has no place in its midst.” – Esther Vilar – You MUST read her book “The Manipulated Man”.
Young men, the book women do not want you to read
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Re: “Forever Single & Happy” occurs at age….
Post by Mr Hindsight on Dec 5, 2004, 2:59pm
I agree, as we age the sex impulse wanes, most likely due to a drop in testosterone. If I were to become un-married, I sure would not get married again.
Besides, there are plenty of females willing to try out for the job!
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Re: “Forever Single & Happy” occurs at age….
Post by OlderBachelor on Dec 5, 2004, 5:41pm
I will add one more comment on this issue – I think the Rubicon is crossed when you realize, as an epiphany, that you no longer need a woman in your life to be happy. When you realize that you can get alone just fine on your own and you are defining yourself by who you are. Not based on what a woman might think about you, but what you think about yourself. Then you know that you don’t need a woman in your life. Females become optional, not a requirement. Then a man doesn’t want to be married anymore and the whole subject of wife and kids becomes irrelevant to him.
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Re: “Forever Single & Happy” occurs at age….
Post by Knight40 on Dec 17, 2004, 6:25pm
Excellent posts.
I concur with those experiences myself, and for those same reasons.
I am 41, and am comfortable being single, I do not need a women to validate who I am as a man.
I have free time to do as I wish, am self employed, make my own hours, and study areas of the mind alot.
Aloneness does not mean being lonely, at least in my experience.
I am light years ahead of my married associates because of what I have learned intellectually, or through wisdom.
I highly recommend single hood to all men.
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Re: “Forever Single & Happy” occurs at age….
Post by The Author on Jul 17, 2005, 1:57am
HappilySingle said:
“Stay single, my friends. Trust me – it gets much easier after 35, and after 40 you’ll be the envy of all your married friends. “
Is this your experience? Or just speculation?
What changes at 35? I think as you approach late 30’s, one must start to confront the very real possibility of not having kids. (Yes, biologically, you can have them anytime, but after 40, the family model of interdependent- supporting generations starts to break down, and kids no longer make sense on many levels.
Most dads I know really like their kids. Are you really such an envy of your friends who see that you never got to experience fatherhood? Sure, they may be sick of their wives, but they love their kids, and probably may NOT trade places with their single friends. Think of how many fathers say “I have no idea what I would do without little Johnny,. etc”
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Re: “Forever Single & Happy” occurs at age….
Post by Never Again on Jul 17, 2005, 6:55am
Back after an indulging hiatus in Cabo, and South Carolina w/ a Goddess.
Excellent posts and all true form my experience as well.
There are plenty of women willing to apply for girlfriend status as well.
As they get older their motives become clearer, they get emboldened and will make their play for marriage earlier than a younger woman IMHO.
That is the your first clue for exit strategy or a commitment imminent.
Excellent post !
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Re: “Forever Single & Happy” occurs at age….
Post by HappilySingle on Jul 17, 2005, 9:03am
Jul 17, 2005, 1:57am, The Author wrote: What changes at 35? I think as you approach late 30’s, one must start to confront the very real possibility of not having kids. (Yes, biologically, you can have them anytime, but after 40, the family model of inter-dependent-supporting generations starts to break down, and kids no longer make sense on many levels.
Two things happened to me at 35 (three, if you count tiring of the “princess syndrome”). First, the libido started dropping (not disappearing, just dropping). Unlike my teenage until early-30s years, I was no longer obsessed with getting laid regularly. Second – and perhaps more important – I started seeing friends my age either going through ugly divorces (and, in a few cases, second divorces) or suffering in hellish marriages.
Quote: Most dads I know really like their kids. Are you really such an envy of your friends who see that you never got to experience fatherhood? Sure, they may be sick of their wives, but they love their kids, and probably may NOT trade places with their single friends. Think of how many fathers say “I have no idea what I would do without little Johnny,. etc”
I’ve mentioned in earlier posts that, while I have no regrets about not being a husband, I do regret not being a father. Many of the divorced fathers I know say the only good thing that came out of their marriage was their child(ren). But, as you correctly note, by the time a man reaches his 40s it is too late (at least in an economic sense) to procreate, as he’d be writing tuition checks well into his 60s.
But going back to being the envy of my single friends: when a man reaches his 40s, he’s reaching his full earnings potential. Those that married and started a family in their 20s will begin writing tuition checks by the time they’re in their mid-40s. Tuition isn’t cheap, and if they have more than one child it can be a financial hardship even if they have a decent job – and it is worse if there has been a divorce. On the other hand, I bought my retirement home in Las Vegas when I was 43; it’ll be paid for by the time I’m in my mid-50s, giving me time to buy a second retirement home if I wish (or giving me the very real option of retiring at 55). Compare this to two of my married male friends who, as they approach 50, are seriously considering taking a second job to help pay their children’s tuitions.
Bachelorhood may not be perfect, but it seems a lot better for today’s man than the alternative.
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Re: “Forever Single & Happy” occurs at age….
Post by LuckilySingle on Jul 17, 2005, 2:52pm
Actually, for me it was about 26. Stopped dating after helping a friend through a divorce, haven’t dated since, that was about 10 years ago now.
LuckilySingle.
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Re: “Forever Single & Happy” occurs at age….
Post by khankrumthebulgar on Jul 18, 2005, 11:13am
After you hit 45 the libido begins to ease off some. I.E. you are not thinking about Sex every 15 seconds like I did in my twenties. And you have enough life experience to evaluate how the mating dance works between the genders. Has all the years of kissing butt, debasing yourself to get laid been worth the effort. If you ask me about my children and Grandchildren I would say yes, about their Mother I would say no. It is for this reason that Women who are smart would marry young. And Men who are wise would never marry. First you wait until you hit your thirties when you have the first crop of Divorcees revved up and ready to play, second if you are successful there are plenty of hot Women who are eager for Male companionship.
And you can build your wealth without the boat anchor of a Family and a Nag (Female Boss) at home. Face it reality is that Women use Nagging as a means of control, or withholding sex or both. Therefore marriage today is a negotiation for how much sex you get. It is fraudulent. And spare me the crap about Religion as Christians have a few percentage point higher Divorce rate than the general population. “Living in Sin” is a total absurd fraud. With the cheating going on in marriage it is not realistic. And Men are stupid to become wage Slaves to a Female predator.
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Re: “Forever Single & Happy” occurs at age….
Post by nameless1 on Jul 18, 2005, 12:10pm
I guess it depends on what really matters to you deep down inside. Obviously the single man will have more monetary wealth than the man with children…. Depends on if you consider wealth to be money, or wealth to be family….I know a lot of men who are sick of their wives as well, but they say becoming a father is a feeling like no other. When you are sick, and when you are laying in that hospital bed almost ready to die, will your house in Las Vegas be there to console you during your last minutes of life? I know you are going to now tell me that just because you have children, doesn’t mean that your children will love you and support you either right? I am aware that children can turn on you, and can be your worst nightmare, however, I think the risk is definitely worth taking. As I said earlier, most fathers I know say there is nothing that compares to being someones DAD. How can you compare material things to being a father? I know, I am such a sappy woman!!!
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Re: “Forever Single & Happy” occurs at age….
Post by LuckilySingle on Jul 18, 2005, 8:23pm
nameless1,
For me, it is less about not wanting to be a father or DAD as you put it, and more about fear of devastation in the event something goes sour.
I know from watching a friend go through the process. It is absolutely gut-wrenching. I always wanted to be a father and have a family, but frankly speaking, unless there is a serious change in family law, the benefits are not worth the potential life-destroying risks.
I will mostly likely pass away lonely. However, that’s better than dying in heart-broken and in poverty when my “spouse” decides that a better offer has come her way and divorces me. Only one, *1* partner need decide a marriage is over. The most common reason for divorce is “general discontent,” commonly called no-fault.
My question is, if this is “no-fault,” why does the man pay such a heavy price for the divorce?
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Re: “Forever Single & Happy” occurs at age….
Post by The Author on Jul 18, 2005, 8:24pm
> Has all the years of kissing butt, debasing yourself to get laid been worth the effort
This type of behavior is anathema to “getting laid”.
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Re: “Forever Single & Happy” occurs at age….
Post by bgrove on Jul 18, 2005, 9:04pm
Been putting in some serious hours at work, for some time now. I am exhausted in every sense of the word. My point: I cannot imagine what it would be like to have to deal with a wife and kids after putting in the hours.
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Re: “Forever Single & Happy” occurs at age….
Post by HappilySingle on Jul 18, 2005, 9:30pm
Jul 18, 2005, 8:23pm, LuckilySingle wrote:
I will mostly likely pass away lonely. However, that’s better than dying in heart-broken and in poverty when my “spouse” decides that a better offer has come her way and divorces me.
You don’t have to pass away lonely. In addition to family, I have a circle of friends – some divorced, some still married – that are like an extended family to me. Keep active, find a career and hobbies you enjoy, and make friends. There will be times of loneliness, but I’m sure many (if not most) married men feel lonely at times, too.
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Re: “Forever Single & Happy” occurs at age….
Post by nameless1 on Jul 21, 2005, 12:32pm
I know for myself, that having friends and hobbies isnt enough for me. I really want my own child. I understand being so afraid of something, that you give up other things….but I also think that if you are 90% sure of someone or something, that you have to take a leap of faith in life. There are always going to be things that scare you, I just dont see how you can give up wanting to be a father, if you want it bad enough, because you are afraid of something that may or may NOT happen 10,20, 30 years down the road. Maybe I have been watching too many romantic movies growing up, and maybe thats my problem here……
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Re: “Forever Single & Happy” occurs at age….
Post by luckilysingle on Jul 21, 2005, 1:08pm
I’d say too many romantic movies. You haven’t seen what I’ve seen in a failed marriage, up close and personal.
It’s not that I don’t want to be a father. It’s simply the risk involved these days. I always wanted to be a father and have a family, but with the way the laws and divorce courts are set up, the cost of a failed marriage/family is simply to high a price.
Unless the laws change, marriage/family is simply not worth the risk.
LuckilySingle.
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Re: “Forever Single & Happy” occurs at age….
Post by John Ross on Jul 22, 2005, 9:48am
Jul 21, 2005, 12:32pm, nameless 1 wrote:
There are always going to be things that scare you, I just dont see how you can give up wanting to be a father, if you want it bad enough, because you are afraid of something that may or may NOT happen 10,20, 30 years down the road.
Nameless, it’s not too many movies, it’s that the realities of marriage and children are very different for women, which the men here keep pointing out. Consider this:
You want a child. We understand that. Suppose, for a moment, that the reality of marriage was such that it was PROBABLE that the following scenario would occur:
You marry, and then YOU shoulder almost all of the financial responsibilities of the marriage.
You have a child. It is the most wonderful thing you can imagine.
Then your husband decides he wants a divorce. You have to move out. Your child stays with him.
You have to pay both lawyers in the divorce, and the divorce itself is the worst thing you have ever experienced in your entire life.
Eventually, it’s over. You have to borrow six figures to pay your ex husband a settlement. You have to pay him low four figures a month in child support and a similar amount monthly for the next five years in alimony.
Instead of seeing your child every day, eating dinner with her and reading to her at bedtime, now you have to work at seeing her. It breaks your heart.
This is the MOST LIKELY scenario for a man who marries and has a child. Would YOU be eager to sign up for marriage and children if what I’ve described was likely to happen TO YOU, and you had absolutely no control over it?
JR
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Re: “Forever Single & Happy” occurs at age….
Post by nameless1 on Jul 22, 2005, 10:00am
Of course not. I dont know what to say. It seems as though more and more white men are not choosing the option of marriage and family. Where will this lead us in terms of the future in our society though?
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Re: “Forever Single & Happy” occurs at age….
Post by HappilySingle on Jul 22, 2005, 10:14am
Jul 22, 2005, 10:00am, nameless1 wrote: Of course not. I dont know what to say. It seems as though more and more white men are not choosing the option of marriage and family. Where will this lead us in terms of the future in our society though?
Hopefully it will lead to a system that is more fair to men in cases of divorce and child custody. Until then, the number of quality single straight men willing to enter into a contract as lopsided as today’s marriage will continue to decline.
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Re: “Forever Single & Happy” occurs at age….
Post by John Ross on Jul 22, 2005, 10:20am
Jul 22, 2005, 10:00am, nameless 1 wrote:
It seems as though more and more white men are not choosing the option of marriage and family. Where will this lead us in terms of the future in our society though?
I wouldn’t worry about that. There are plenty of people in the world having kids. Concern yourself with YOUR life and not society as a whole.
JR
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Re: “Forever Single & Happy” occurs at age….
Post by ThaPhenom on Jul 22, 2005, 12:50pm
I think it’s just going to lead to a world where more and more children are born outside of marriage. John Ross is right, there are plenty of people still having kids. The rate of children born outside of marriage has risen over the last 40 years, and will continue to do so.
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Re: “Forever Single & Happy” occurs at age….
Post by thechief on Jul 22, 2005, 2:12pm
Jul 22, 2005, 10:00am, nameless 1 wrote:
Of course not. I dont know what to say. It seems as though more and more white men are not choosing the option of marriage and family. Where will this lead us in terms of the future in our society though?
From a broader sociological sense, it may well lead to the white race becoming a minority in this country. As you say, fewer white men are reproducing, and the media and the government either don’t seem to notice or don’t seem to care. I think that’s part of the reason that both Republicans and Democrats refuse to address our illegal immigration problem–whites, the current majority, aren’t reproducing fast enough to keep our current social infrastructure viable. We’ve got to have workers and warm bodies from somewhere, so we’ll get them from south of the border.
As a white man, I’m going to go ahead and say it–screw the white race. If our society has made it so unpleasant and dangerous for us to reproduce, then our society deserves to whither and die.
The thing I don’t get is black men. Maybe one of you guys can help me. I’m a child support worker, used to work in St. Louis, dealt with a lot of inner city African Americans. There’s something like an 80% illegitimacy rate in the black community. I saw thousands of black men who fathered children out of wedlock and ended up in child support hell. It’s like they skip the two or three good years your average marriage might produce and go straight to the really bad part–paying big bucks for kids you never see, your financial life tied to a woman who hates you, etc, etc. And many of them keep doing this over and over again (I had one father who had eight cases–at least eight different children with eight different women. This man worked as a janitor, BTW. He’ll never be able to pay all of his child support). Can Willie Molson (whom I respect tremendously, please don’t think I’m a bigot) or one of our other African American members explain this to me? Can anybody?
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Re: “Forever Single & Happy” occurs at age….
Post by Mike on Jul 22, 2005, 3:57pm
Jul 22, 2005, 2:12pm, thechief wrote:
I think that’s part of the reason that both Republicans and Democrats refuse to address our illegal immigration problem–whites, the current majority, aren’t reproducing fast enough to keep our current social infrastructure viable. We’ve got to have workers and warm bodies from somewhere, so we’ll get them from south of the border.
This is true, and it’s also false. White people are not reproducing at anything resembling a replacement level (minimum 2.1 children per woman). What is false is the notion that this fact is a viable excuse for lack of border control.
We do not need to import a huge labor force, and though I really hate to reduce it to such simple terms, I really must in order to make the point.
Fewer people = less work to do = fewer people needed.
More people = more work to do = more people needed.
If there were tomorrow 20 million fewer people in California, we could likely live without a large number of crop pickers, fast food workers, garbage men, etc. But the more immigrants come, the more jobs there are to fill – it’s a runaway train. This is why you can never trust an economist – they’re educated morons who can make a stupid idea sound intelligent. A politician is one who believes an economist.
I don’t wish to broach broad conspiracy theories about why the huge foreign immigration wave is allowed to continue. Many people gain, from businesses getting cheap labor to liberal politicians getting votes. But the overall result is a crowding out of Whites.
If the Mexicans coming were carrying guns, we’d call it an invasion. But instead, they bring genes, and out breed us. It doesn’t matter what the weapons are – the fact remains that a demographic war is in progress, and judging by current trends, Whites are going to lose. Why?
Our birth rates are lower than any other race.
Miscegenation is at an all-time high.
And on purely biological terms, whenever two subspecies live in the same territory, one will eventually crowd the other out in competition for resources.
Fact is, the White race, wherever it lives from America to Europe to Australia, is committing suicide.
Some of you, it seems, are perfectly content to let the race of Beethoven, Galileo, Newton, Rembrandt, Shockley, Mozart, Plato, Schopenhauer, and daVinci go the way of the dodo; and still more are helping it on its way. But I don’t think that the race which also spawned Alexander the Great, Harald Hardrada, Richard the Lionheart, Charlemagne, and George Patton is one to give up so easily.
I realize these are not popular opinions; much in the same vein that the addict or the suicidal person does not wish to be told of his problems. I do not need to point out that our “culture” tells us that for any non- White race to stick up for itself is okay, but for Whites is “raaaaaayycism.”
You men promoting race mixing must understand the larger context. It’s not merely a matter of finding the feminine qualities. It’s a matter of helping to ring the death knell for your own race. Look past the end of your own nose for once.
Race mixing = Genocide. And that’s even against the U.N. Charter.
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Re: “Forever Single & Happy” occurs at age….
Post by ThaPhenom on Jul 22, 2005, 8:24pm
Quote:
The thing I don’t get is black men. Maybe one of you guys can help me. I’m a child support worker, used to work in St. Louis, dealt with a lot of inner city African Americans. There’s something like an 80% illegitimacy rate in the black community. I saw thousands of black men who fathered children out of wedlock and ended up in child support hell. It’s like they skip the two or three good years your average marriage might produce and go straight to the really bad part–paying big bucks for kids you never see, your financial life tied to a woman who hates you, etc, etc. And many of them keep doing this over and over again (I had one father who had eight cases–at least eight different children with eight different women. This man worked as a janitor, BTW. He’ll never be able to pay all of his child support). Can Willie Molson (whom I respect tremendously, please don’t think I’m a bigot) or one of our other African American members explain this to me? Can anybody?
This is just a microcosm of today’s hookup culture. What you see a lot of times is those who are at an income level closer to the poverty line having more children, mostly out of wedlock, and those further away from the poverty line, who are more financially equipped to raise children, having less children, and least likely out of wedlock. There’s no one thing you can point to as to why the rate of children born outside of marriage has tripled or even quadrupled in the Black community since the end of the civil rights movement. I might venture to say the very social welfare programs (including affirmative action) that were intended to help black people, and continue to be protected by liberals in this country, fell far short of their mark and in fact had some unintended negative consequences for the black community as a whole. And before anyone jumps on me…I am a black male.
And as far as what Mike as to say…the only race I belong to is the HUMAN race.
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Re: “Forever Single & Happy” occurs at age….
Post by Riskbreaker on Jul 22, 2005, 9:09pm
And as far as what Mike as to say…the only race I belong to is the HUMAN race.
*One day, Mike may gain enlightenment and see that problems affect HUMANS, not RACES.
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Re: “Forever Single & Happy” occurs at age….
Post by bgrove on Jul 26, 2005, 9:36am
Jul 21, 2005, 12:32pm, nameless 1 wrote:
I know for myself, that having friends and hobbies isnt enough for me. I really want my own child.
I can’t understand that really, and have always wondered why all the women I know want children… and now…. you have to have a firm financial setting before even contemplating it.
I was once told by a GF that we were going to get married and have kids. It was more of a command than anything else. I told her, “We’ll see.” That reply really pissed her off, but I explained that you have to have a good foundation before you can have a family or even get married.
What pissed me off, in turn, was that she said that “You don’t need money to be happy.” On some level that is true. But I still thought that was a stupid thing for her to say. I don’t think either of us ever got over that brief conversation. In fact, I think that it drove a wedge between us.
The thing is, At that time, I wasn’t necessarily averse to the idea of getting married and having kids; and in fact, never gave it much thought.
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Re: “Forever Single & Happy” occurs at age….
Post by Never Again on Jul 26, 2005, 10:17am
Nameless1 writes :
“I guess it depends on what really matters to you deep down inside. Obviously the single man will have more monetary wealth than the man with children…. Depends on if you consider wealth to be money, or wealth to be family….I know a lot of men who are sick of their wives as well, but they say becoming a father is a feeling like no other. When you are sick, and when you are laying in that hospital bed almost ready to die, will your house in Las Vegas be there to console you during your last minutes of life? I know you are going to now tell me that just because you have children, doesn’t mean that your children will love you and support you either right? I am aware that children can turn on you, and can be your worst nightmare, however, I think the risk is definitely worth taking. As I said earlier, most fathers I know say there is nothing that compares to being someones DAD. How can you compare material things to being a father? I know, I am such a sappy woman!!!”
All admirable virtuous, idealistic conceptual constructs.
However not REALISTIC in the realty and scheme of things.
bgrove writes : “What pissed me off, in turn, was that she said that “You don’t need money to be happy.” On some level that is true. But I still thought that was a stupid thing for her to say. I don’t think either of us ever got over that brief conversation. In fact, I think that it drove a wedge between us.”
The only level that is true if you are a hermit, living in a commune or completely disavoid of ALL material possessions in life.
NET, NET NET or bottom line is :
In a capitalistic, free exchange society you will need MONEY to exist depending on what level you chose to or lifestyle you seek dictates.
The virtuous construct that nothing can replace being a father or mother will ALWAYS be overshadowed by being a father or mother and ALSO having the financial means or discretionary income to allow/provide/mentor/facilitate/benefactor some semblance of education/success/business et al etc. top your children for their benefit.
Success breeds success and it is the definition of success that is varied.
On some level in a free enterprise society and system MONEY is a necessity as it promulgates freedom and the ability to make choices …..
It is not the ONLY thing it is however a important component of freedom and the ability to make choices in life.
Spending time with your children is an also tantamount to having the financial means to invest in their future/development/influence/mentor/ teach/share with your children.
“Rich or poor it’s nice to have money ….”
It’s how a person chooses to spend/save/utilize/a portion/ it that can make the difference.
It depends what you want out of life……
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Re: “Forever Single & Happy” occurs at age….
Post by HappilySingle on Jul 26, 2005, 10:41am
Jul 18, 2005, 12:10pm, nameless1 wrote:
I guess it depends on what really matters to you deep down inside. Obviously the single man will have more monetary wealth than the man with children…. Depends on if you consider wealth to be money, or wealth to be family….
Let’s see…my company’s health insurance provider goes broke…a married friend and I each have a heart attack from the shock of the news. We’re both rushed to the hospital; intake asks how we intend to take care of the financial responsibility of hospitalization. I mention that I have two homes with over $200k in total equity, a business worth almost that much, well over $100k in retirement savings and a $25k emergency fund. My friend says “I have a beautiful wife, three lovely kids, an adorable grandchild, and $12k in credit card debt.” Family is a lot of things – some good, some not – but to call it “wealth” is idiotic and simplistic.
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Re: “Forever Single & Happy” occurs at age….
Post by nameless1 on Jul 26, 2005, 12:35pm
There’s the difference between me and you. I guess my priorities are just completely different here, maybe because I work in a hospital and I see such unfortunate cases every day…I feel that no amount of money compares to having family, friends, people you can trust and LOVE. Im sorry, call it simplistic or idiotic, but thats how I feel. Family is wealth. having your two legs to walk down the street with is wealth. have you ever appreciated that you guys have something that a lot of people dont have, your health? I really truly hope that your reasons for not wanting to marry arent solely based on money guys. It starting to sound very much like that…..
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Re: “Forever Single & Happy” occurs at age….
Post by HappilySingle on Jul 26, 2005, 12:49pm
Jul 26, 2005, 12:35pm, nameless1 wrote:
I really truly hope that your reasons for not wanting to marry arent solely based on money guys. It starting to sound very much like that…..
But that is a major reason, nameless. A failed marriage can ruin a man financially for life. If you’ve been reading this forum carefully, you would have realized this a long time ago.
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Re: “Forever Single & Happy” occurs at age….
Post by Mikey on Jul 26, 2005, 1:13pm
Jul 22, 2005, 9:09pm, Riskbreaker wrote:
And as far as what Mike as to say…the only race I belong to is the HUMAN race.
*One day, Mike may gain enlightenment and see that problems affect HUMANS, not RACES.
So strange to hear that from someone who belongs to the race which considers itself “Chosen” by the Creator of the Universe.
And just like the rest of you, you pretend to be part of the majority when it suits you, and when it doesn’t, you’re an oppressed and persecuted “religious” minority.
You’re not fooling anyone.
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Re: “Forever Single & Happy” occurs at age….
Post by Agitator on Jul 26, 2005, 8:14pm
Dec 5, 2004, 2:59pm, Mr Hindsight wrote:
I agree, as we age the sex impulse wanes, most likely due to a drop in testosterone. If I were to become un-married, I sure would not get married again.Besides, there are plenty of females willing to try out for the job!
AFAIK testosterone increases in men after a certain age (late 30s?).
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Re: “Forever Single & Happy” occurs at age….
Post by DJ Bobo on Jul 26, 2005, 8:36pm
This year, at 30, I realized that I don’t need a woman at all. It took a tremendous burden off my shoulder and I’ve felt a lot more productive and creative since then. I have at last exited this terrible melancholic stage which I entered as a brainwashed young man in my early 20s.
I have also decided that I’m going to work toward and apply to medical school. Would I be able to do this with a woman (and family) in tow? Most probably not. What can I say – I enjoy my newfound freedom and I am thankful to have had the insight offered on fora such as this that taught me the meaning of true independence.
A man can never be independent when he is tied to a woman, no matter how “adventurous, rebellious, and ‘liberated’” she may be in her youth. Woman does not possess the intellectual freedom of man, even as she hides her ultimate objectives and subsequent limitations from herself the most. In a “healthy relationship” women always seek a family (based around motherhood, which validates their existence) as the means to an end and in this brainwashed society men are made to believe that this is the highest goal that they must therefore also aspire to. Brothers, I tell you this isn’t so; family is not man’s ultimate ambition, but merely his limitation! Look at all the geniuses (95+% men) who lived in the past; they all performed their most significant work before the shackles of marriage condemned them to intellectual slavery. Only this feminized society brainwashes men into believing otherwise. The consequence: a life of intellectual stagnation.
When I realized this lesson and reality had sunk in, I couldn’t help but relish my new-found, true independence! I’m eternally in debt to those who made these fora for open and accessible exchange of ideas possible.
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Re: “Forever Single & Happy” occurs at age….
Post by TyHigs1 on Jul 26, 2005, 8:48pm
The American philosopher H L Mencken wrote about this very topic. He said that geniuses tend not to marry, but if they do, they do so after middle age when their senses have been dulled. If you do a websearch you can find free links to his work. He is not a misogynist, IMO, btw.
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Re: “Forever Single & Happy” occurs at age….
Post by mememe on Dec 22, 2005, 4:50am
I’ve found this to be an interesting article.
Seems to be applicable to my situation anyhow.
I also find it interesting how an otherwise intelligent, professional, and competent woman (Beth) becomes very vehemently opinionated when it comes to the topic of men purposely avoiding marriage. “Losers are we” ?
I’m not too far away from that 37-43 age range they assert is the death knell to getting married. I’ve always been a loner & unafraid of what others thought of me — so not too much longer to go, I suppose…
WHEN BETH, one of my better researchers, said that men who were averse to commitment were drawn to her like bees to honey, I gave her a copy of the summary report of my research on “why men marry.” The report showed that the primary reason a man asks one woman to marry and not another is that each woman treats him differently.
After looking it over for about fifteen minutes, Beth returned the report to my desk and told me I was a male chauvinist. I was taken aback for a moment.
I was fond of Beth and trying to help her, so after I recovered, I asked her what made her think that.
She said, “You reinforce the myth that the reason men don’t commit is that the women in their lives do something wrong. That’s nonsense. In most cases, it’s the man in a relationship who decides he isn’t ready or doesn’t want to get married, and he makes this decision without any help from the woman.
No matter what some women do, there are certain men who are never going to commit. Unless you recognize that, you’ve missed the whole point. If you want to do women a real service, help us identify those losers before we get involved with them.”
After telling Beth that more than three hundred women had worked with me on the marriage research and not one had made the comment she just offered, I apologized. I had to admit she had a point. My interviews with single men had shown there were men who would not commit. Beth was also right when she said that if I could help women identify which men were more likely to commit, I would be performing a real service. As a reward for her insight, I put her in charge of the project.
Looking for Mr. Right
My researchers approached this project the same way we had others. First, Beth reviewed the literature and research we had on file. With this in mind, I reviewed our interviews with men and women who were planning to marry and videos of two focus groups we had run with single men. We then broadened the study by surveying and then running focus groups of single men who at that time had no intention of getting married. At first, we had young single men do the interviews, but so many of the interviewees gave macho answers that we doubted their reliability. In fact, we threw out the entire study and started again.
The second time we tried teams composed of men and women, but that produced mainly politically correct answers, which we also questioned.
Finally, we had men in their sixties ask the questions, and that solved the problem. The responses they elicited were generally straightforward. The single men apparently did not feel an obligation to give these interviewers macho or politically correct answers.
Is He Old Enough to Marry?
This survey uncovered some interesting facts. The first was that there is an age when a man is ready to marry-the Age of Commitment. The age varies from man to man, but there are patterns that are easily identified:
• Most men who graduate from high school start thinking of marriage as a real possibility when they are twenty-three or twenty-four.
• Most men who graduate from college don’t start considering marriage as a real possibility until age twenty-six.
• When men go to graduate school, it takes them longer to get into the working world, and they’re not ready to get married until a few years after that.
• Ninety percent of men who have graduated from college are ready for the next step between ages twenty-six and thirty-three; this is when they are most likely to consider marriage. But this window of opportunity stays open only for four to five years, and then the chances a man will marry start to decline.
• A majority of college graduates between twenty-eight and thirty-three are in their high-commitment years and likely to propose.
• This period for well-educated men lasts just a bit over five years. The chances men will commit are sightly less when they are thirty-one or thirty-two than when they were between twenty-eight and thirty, but they’re still in a high-commitment phase.
• Once men reach thirty-three or thirty-four, the chances they’ll commit start to diminish, but only slightly. Until men reach thirty-seven, they remain very good prospects.
• After age thirty-eight, the chances they will ever marry drop dramatically.
• The chances that a man will marry for the first time diminish even more once he reaches forty-two or forty-three. At this point, many men become confirmed bachelors.
• Once men reach age forty-seven to fifty without marrying, the chances they will marry do not disappear, but they drop dramatically.
Still, there is no one-to-one correlation. For example, when a man goes to law school, which takes three additional years, he usually starts considering marriage around age twenty-seven or twenty-eight. That’s also the age when most doctors, who spend four years in medical school and at least one year as an intern, start seriously thinking about marriage.
The single men we interviewed explained that when they get out of school and get a job and start making money, new possibilities open to them. For the first time, a majority of them have some independence. All of a sudden, they have a nice car and an apartment and an income. They’re reluctant to even consider marriage for a few years, because they want to sow their wild oats. Many look at time spent as a carefree bachelor as a rite of passage. So for the first few years that they’re on their own, their primary goal is having fun, which translates into dating without any serious thoughts about marriage.
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Re: “Forever Single & Happy” occurs at age….
Post by A Man on Dec 22, 2005, 9:09am
Quote:
No matter what some women do, there are certain men who are never going to commit.
Yea? So?
It’s funny how a man’s “fear” of, or “unwillingness” to commit is often perceived as a bad thing. Women are much more likely to bail. They just tend to wait until AFTER the papers are signed so they can cash out.
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Re: “Forever Single & Happy” occurs at age….
Post by soon to be SolShinobi on Dec 22, 2005, 10:28am
Jul 22, 2005, 2:12pm, thechief wrote:
The thing I don’t get is black men. Maybe one of you guys can help me. I’m a child support worker, used to work in St. Louis, dealt with a lot of inner city African Americans. There’s something like an 80% illegitimacy rate in the black community. I saw thousands of black men who fathered children out of wedlock and ended up in child support hell. It’s like they skip the two or three good years your average marriage might produce and go straight to the really bad part–paying big bucks for kids you never see, your financial life tied to a woman who hates you, etc, etc. And many of them keep doing this over and over again (I had one father who had eight cases–at least eight different children with eight different women. This man worked as a janitor, BTW. He’ll never be able to pay all of his child support). Can Willie Molson (whom I respect tremendously, please don’t think I’m a bigot) or one of our other African American members explain this to me? Can anybody?
As a black man i’ll say this. I think it comes to what you are taught and your environment teaches you alot. I grew up in a poor neighborhood in Memphis. I now work at a fortune 500 company out of Atlanta. I have 1 child out of wedlock however we did everything but get the marriage done and i was well on my way to do that before the crash and burn. I was engaged before that relationship years before. It could be education, it could be peer pressure to have sex versus the young and horny mentality. Many don’t like condoms but once again….education. Many don’t see the negative sides until it is too late or those on the negative side, stupidly glorify that they have this many “baby’s mamas” or have “this many” children. Chest beating happens on all levels with all types of men. No one wants to appear sub par regardless of the situation.
My son’s mother and i are friends however i saw many signs that said this was not for me. Then later on i was witness to other things that was the straw that broke the camel’s back for me. I don’t date and I sure as hell won’t get married. I love my son, but that 1 child is enough for me in my lifetime.
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Re: “Forever Single & Happy” occurs at age….
Post by soon to be SolShinobi on Dec 22, 2005, 10:36am
Jul 26, 2005, 12:35pm, nameless1 wrote:
There’s the difference between me and you. I guess my priorities are just completely different here, maybe because I work in a hospital and I see such unfortunate cases every day…I feel that no amount of money compares to having family, friends, people you can trust and LOVE. Im sorry, call it simplistic or idiotic, but thats how I feel. Family is wealth. having your two legs to walk down the street with is wealth. have you ever appreciated that you guys have something that a lot of people dont have, your health? I really truly hope that your reasons for not wanting to marry arent solely based on money guys. It starting to sound very much like that…..
I am thankful for many things and i do thank God constantly. My mother was a nurse and a nursing professor. So i saw alot of what you might see everyday. I see what both of you are saying and understand both points.
However, my personal opinion (giving it freely lol) is that love between men/women has become a false love. It no longer is about caring selflessly. It’s now only a business. Nothing more or less. Jewelry companies are constantly throwing their propaganda on us through the women. Stating the ONLY way you can get love is through material items. Women eat this up because it benefits them. The name of the game here now in dating is one thing and one thing only….
Who wants to play…..Who can get screwed the fastest!
Whether it be emotionally or financially is does a number on you. You can survive and become stronger however there is a price. You become darker about the whole thing.
Yes, movies and basically tv in general have brain washed many a man and woman. We all go in thinking one thing and another takes place.
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Forever Single & Happy
Post by Hyperion on Dec 22, 2005, 10:40am
Jul 22, 2005, 2:12pm, thechief wrote:
As a white man, I’m going to go ahead and say it–screw the white race. If our society has made it so unpleasant and dangerous for us to reproduce, then our society deserves to whither and die.
No it does not. We have much to be proud of.
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Re: “Forever Single & Happy” occurs at age….
Post by Snakey on Dec 22, 2005, 11:52am
Your post is interesting Mike, but really what’s your solution for us white men? Walk head-first into a death trap (child with white AW) for some abstract lofty aesthetic ideal? This seems a grander current of human history than any individual choices we make. Why fight it? I’ll mix genes with whoever seems a suitable partner. Odds are it’ll be Asian or Latino. I’m betting the human race will be denied no Mozart or Newton by my choice.
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Re: “Forever Single & Happy” occurs at age….
Post by newplaya on Dec 22, 2005, 12:00pm
Ha Ha Ha
The enotalone article follows the progress of young men out of college or university. What is the ratio of men to women? It’s rapidly closing on 2 to 1.
This ration guarantees a god awful mess within relationship dynamics. It comes from two seemingly contradictory places.
Women being hypergamous. But they’ve fucked up the gender ratios. They, in the majority, will short sightedly turn-up-the-nose at regular dudes.
Men in a great ratio environment (college ) choosing to select one female only?
It is to laugh.
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Re: “Forever Single & Happy” occurs at age….
Post by Hyperion on Dec 22, 2005, 12:20pm
Dec 22, 2005, 11:52am, Snakey wrote:
Your post is interesting Mike, but really what’s your solution for us white men?
The solution is for us to be men in order to stand and fight. Which is the one thing most of you won’t do, as indicated by all the “Where can I run to?” posts, if you stood and fought, things would change. As it is, guys on boards like this constantly ask where they can run to, yet never see the link between them fleeing and things getting worse, because they won’t stand and fight.
Quote:
Why fight it?
Because conflict in an integral part of existence, and our race is well worth preserving, despite what others say. And like I say, while you might run from conflict, conflict never runs from you.
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Re: “Forever Single & Happy” occurs at age….
Post by Snakey on Dec 22, 2005, 12:55pm
“Stand and fight”. What do you mean by this? Fight whom? With what weapons? I don’t dig the vagueness … so much implied meaning reeks of the same tactics feminists use. It clouds the mind with emotion, in this case attempting to stir up a defence of my virility. (“What are ya, chicken?” etc.)
And: If conflict is an integral part of existence, given that I exist and am therefore in a state of conflict, I will not need to induce artificial conflicts to coincide with someone else’s aesthetic ideal.
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Re: “Forever Single & Happy” occurs at age….
Post by logic101 on Dec 22, 2005, 1:18pm
Dec 5, 2004, 1:43pm, Older Bachelor wrote:
I have 2 close male friends that I have both known for over 10 years and they are 52 and 45. Never married, no kids. We talk once in awhile about our situation and let me tell you the consensus: Once a man hits a certain age without marrying and having kids, you get used to your life the way it is and start to lose interest in the whole thing. – Esther Vilar – You MUST read her book “The Manipulated Man”
Just seek/find the real truth and avoid western society’s propaganda.
You’ll finally make a decision that is truly in YOUR best interest.
-Logic 101
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Re: “Forever Single & Happy” occurs at age….
Post by Hyperion on Dec 22, 2005, 1:35pm
Dec 22, 2005, 12:55pm, Snakey wrote:
“Stand and fight”. What do you mean by this? Fight whom?
Whoever is passing the anti-man laws.
Quote:
With what weapons?
I’ll leave that up to you.
Quote:
I don’t dig the vagueness … so much implied meaning reeks of the same tactics feminists use.
Relax, I’m no feminist, my opinions would probably send them into spasms of shock.
Quote:
And: If conflict is an integral part of existence, given that I exist and am therefore in a state of conflict, I will not need to induce artificial conflicts to coincide with someone else’s aesthetic ideal.
That is no artificial conflict, it’s real.
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Re: “Forever Single & Happy” occurs at age….
Post by dataguy on Dec 22, 2005, 2:32pm
Excellent OP.
Around this time each year, I like to take stock of where my life is at, as compared to the lives of my dad and my friends.
Let’s see:
1. My mom divorced her first husband in 1955 because he didn’t want to have kids. She started dating my dad in early 1956, and by the end of that year she was pregnant. In 1957 they got married. Then, she turned out to be a completely hysterical emotional infant who drove my dad out of the house within a dozen years. Then, the better job he had finally landed, after years of going to night school so he could provide better for his family, ended up falling through, so by the time my dad was my age, he was divorced, broke, unemployed, and living with his mother.
2. My high school buddy Mark got married in his early 20s. He never bothered going to college, and once he got started on the family treadmill, college pretty much ceased to be an option.
Then his wife decided that she loved crystal meth more than she loved her family. It took him years of litigation and cost him everything he had to win custody of his kids because she was “The Mom”. Then, earlier this year, he got fired from a company where he had worked for 25 years, at the only real job he’d ever had. And so today, in addition to having two emotionally shaky teenage daughters on his hands, he finds himself, at my age, divorced, broke, unemployed, uneducated, and living with his mother.
3. My college friend Jerry was married for 10 years to his high school girlfriend. One day he came home from work and his wife sat him down and said, “Jerry, I’ve found a woman who satisfies me sexually better than you do. I’ve been having an affair with Louise for months now. I want a divorce, and I need you to move out so I can have Louise over whenever I want. And in the meantime, I need you to leave all our joint credit accounts open so I can max them all out and not pay the bills and leave your credit ruined for the next decade or so.”
Well, that’s not exactly what she said, but that is exactly what happened. Within a year, he’d married another woman who kept him so stuffed full of fatty foods that he blew out to 300 pounds. Then she divorced him and took half the house equity. So today, he’s twice divorced, broke, working as a clerk in a bookstore, and living with his parents.
4. My friend Bret is about 10 years younger than me. His first wife was a former crystal meth addict whose first baby was killed by her first boyfriend, and who Bret ended up divorcing because he wanted kids and she couldn’t have them. Then, he became so worried about being single and alone the rest of his life that he recently married a woman who had two kids from a previous marriage with a guy who went off and became a Jehovah’s Witness, but who’s still battling her for custody and visitation. And he did this after admitting to me that he didn’t really love her and he wasn’t even particularly attracted to her.
5. My friend Rob was a nerdy, geeky, unathletic spazz when he was young. As a result, he wasn’t particularly attractive to good looking girls. Today, he’s a totally rugged mountaineer and outdoor sportsman, as well as being quite a brilliant and very well employed computer hardware engineer. He finally got married in his 40s, but his wife is about 100 pounds overweight. And I’ve met her, and she seems nice, but she’s 100 pounds overweight.
Meanwhile, I am in the best position I’ve ever been in my entire life. I’m well educated and I have a great job in my chosen profession which pays well and is very stable and secure. I’m in the best physical shape I’ve ever been in (150lbs, 32″ waist, work out daily, can hike up a 10000′ mountain in 2-3 hours and feel just great). I have no mortgage, no alimony, no child support, no debts, a great retirement program, excellent health insurance, and plenty of cash in the bank.
I can spend an entire weekend setting up a new server, working through a new tech book, hanging out at Borders, reading the paper, watching the game, or whatever else I please, with no interruptions, no nagging, no arguments, no drama, no stress, in fact, no real trouble at all. I often find myself remarking just how trouble-free, stress-free, and drama-free my life is.
I can fly off to Reno or Vegas or jump in the truck for a day trip to the mountains or desert or light up a Swisher Sweet or do pretty much anything else I damn well please without asking permission. And if I get horny, there are always plenty of women out there who are such total sluts that they will literally fuck anything.
I can’t think of any guy I personally know that I would really want to trade lives with. In fact, I think it’s time to seriously re-define the meaning of the term ‘loser’.
I can’t say for sure if there’s an exact age when a guy realizes he’s a confirmed bachelor, but I think there’s a general point in life when he realizes that his life is actually better than that of pretty much all of his married buddies. Personally, I reached that point years ago.
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Re: “Forever Single & Happy” occurs at age….
Post by guest on Dec 23, 2005, 6:51pm
How old are you?
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