Are kids the problem?
Are kids the problem?
Post by openeyes on Dec 15, 2005, 2:08pm
I just got back from a business dinner, and since it was all men and I was the youngest one there, one of the guys took it upon himself to tell me his secret to staying young and leading a happy life: don’t have kids. He’s seen how it’s destroyed all the guys he went to school with, but he doesn’t consider it to be simply marriage that does it, since he’s been happily married 21 years now.
I know I’ve heard that the happiest years of marriage are before the kids are born, and after the kids move out. So could indeed the main killer be having kids? And as I’ve often said before, if not to have children, why marry? Just live together with a written “living together” contract if you must. For now I’m not too set on even just living with a woman, but at least my thoughts on not having kids have been reinforced.
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Re: Are kids the problem?
Post by GuestWill on Dec 15, 2005, 2:10pm
? And as I’ve often said before, if not to have children, why marry?
Exactly. Substance over form.
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Re: Are kids the problem?
Post by mija on Dec 15, 2005, 2:23pm
Dec 15, 2005, 2:08pm, openeyes wrote:I just got back from a business dinner, and since it was all men and I was the youngest one there, one of the guys took it upon himself to tell me his secret to staying young and leading a happy life: don’t have kids. He’s seen how it’s destroyed all the guys he went to school with, but he doesn’t consider it to be simply marriage that does it, since he’s been happily married 21 years now.
I know I’ve heard that the happiest years of marriage are before the kids are born, and after the kids move out. So could indeed the main killer be having kids? And as I’ve often said before, if not to have children, why marry? Just live together with a written “living together” contract if you must. For now I’m not too set on even just living with a woman, but at least my thoughts on not having kids have been reinforced.
This is actually an interesting topic. A hot one.
Anything relating to having to constantly give give give without any receiving, is going to take years off your life. It’s the energy you put into it. And children isn’t for everyone.
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Re: Are kids the problem?
Post by Allah on Dec 15, 2005, 2:31pm
Good point: why marry if you don’t intend to have children?
Well, in the case of my friend who is American and his woman, Australian, they got married specifically because he couldn’t live in her country and she couldn’t live in his and they have agreed to remain childless. My wife and I also had some immigration issues: we both wanted to move to Europe (I have an EU passport and she doesn’t, getting married enables her to work there) and we are not presently desirous of children.
Some reasons:
- You’re both religious and love each other and shacking up just isn’t quite right in your viewpoint. Let’s say a middle-aged couple meet, both go to the same church, love each other, are past childbearing age, don’t believe in fornication, then getting married could make sense.
- Immigration: once again, you can’t legally work in her country, she can’t legally work and live in your country. Getting married gives you right of residence in either place.
- Believe it or not, and in, very, very, very rare cases, it could be financially advantageous a fiscally responsible and successful man and woman past childbearing age pooling their resources together: dual income buys bigger house, they have enough together for one Rolls Royce, etc. As I said, this is so very rare indeed that I think only about 1% of childless marriages can be imputed to this. True, you could just stay single and combine resources whilst unwed, but there may be tax breaks involved if you’re legally married depending on where you live.
- Respect from the community: your relationship is more sanitized being married, but then again, why are you so hung up on what the community thinks? They probably don’t care about you.
- You fell in love, got married with the intention of having kids, and it just didn’t happen, you look at your friends who struggle with kids everyday, and you think, “thank you, Jesus!” So, you’re a family of two, and you’re happy.
But, generally, having non-bastard children (a man-made concept rather outmoded) is the reason to have children. Then again, I’m a fan of the traditional family for those who decide to breed.
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Re: Are kids the problem?
Post by thechief on Dec 15, 2005, 4:46pm
Are kids the problem? Yes. In a living together situation with no kids, or even a marriage with separate assets/credit lines/bank accounts and as good a prenup as you can get, most men will probably be OK, even if it leads to divorce. The balance of power will be more or less equal.
Throw in kids, and it’s like she’s armed with a nuke and you have a stone knife. Kids give women too much power, too much leverage in the relationship. Sad but true.
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Re: Are kids the problem?
Post by mija on Dec 15, 2005, 5:38pm
Oh don’t get me started on how many ridiculous “rights” a kid has in this damn country….
They can divorce their parents! This is absurd. It’s not their fault, I know but the fact that the option is there is crazy.
What ever happened to Parents being the boss and the kid being the kid?
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Re: Are kids the problem?
Post by SumYungGi on Dec 15, 2005, 5:39pm
I wouldn’t say kids are the problem as much as they are an option. In our lives we can pursue many different interests: accumulating wealth, honing athletic ability, pursuing artistic aspirations, learning, and raising a family. You choose what’s important to you and pursue it. Not everyone wants to be rich, or at least wants it at the expense of everything else. Most wealthy people had to make great sacrifices to ge their wealth, and a family was one of them. If you’d rather have a Ferrari then a son, then fine, but some people can actually be happy without being millionaires. Money actually isn’t everything, believe it or not. Like my business professor said ‘You can chase money, or you chase skirts, pick.’
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Re: Are kids the problem?
Post by standard deviator on Dec 15, 2005, 7:53pm
I’ve been married twelve years (non-American woman) and we have no kids. I couldn’t be happier. People tell me I look about a decade younger than I do, and I get lots of thinly-veiled envy from parents when they ask me what I did for my weekend…
Them: Pile the screeching brats into the applesauce-stained minivan for a rendezvous with a giant rat at Chuck E. Cheese. Come home and collapse in an exhausted heap.
Me: Sleep in late, take a leisurely walk, curl up by the fire with a book on physics or philosophy, enjoy an elegant meal at a good restaurant.
And then there is the money saved…no college fund, no braces, no gigantic house with four bedrooms, no private school = lots of savings plus money to enjoy the finer things in life as well. And through the miracle of compound interest, saved money means more money, which means more money…which means retirement in your 50s, or at least downshifting to unstressful part-time work.
Do I feel “discriminated against by society” for not having kids? Not really. Since I don’t have to take care of kids, I can work longer at work while also having more quiet personal time at home. The upshot is I get more done, which makes me a valuable and respected member of the company, while also having more free time than the average parent. And people with kids enjoy spending time with me as a “breath of fresh air” from the competitive atmosphere that develops when they socialize with other parents. It all works out just fine
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Re: Are kids the problem?
Post by toadman1 on Dec 15, 2005, 8:15pm
“I wouldn’t say kids are the problem as much as they are an option. You choose what’s important to you and pursue it.”
Just make sure it’s YOUR choice. It’s an 18 year $1/4mil expense per child to the age of 18, not including college but no-one looks that far ahead in the early adult years. I stuck it out for 18 years with the ex until the bitter cheating end for “sake of the kid”.
Now I look around like Neo at the end of The Matrix and see this…this… facade for what it truly is. The truth will set you free. What was I thinking in my 20’s?! *bonk bonk*
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Re: Are kids the problem?
Post by Never Again on Dec 15, 2005, 9:14pm
The kids are not the problem it is the generally the woman who manipulate, convolute and prevaricate the truth and vilify the men to the kids.
Has been and most likely will continue that way.
yes, some men screw up, yes not ALL women do it BUT
generally the hopelessness of the plight and their need for survival implores them to do the deeds….
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Re: Are kids the problem?
Post by logic101 on Dec 16, 2005, 1:29am
Dec 15, 2005, 8:15pm, toadman1 wrote:
“I wouldn’t say kids are the problem as much as they are an option. You choose what’s important to you and pursue it.”
Now I look around like Neo at the end of The Matrix and see this…this… facade for what it truly is. The truth will set you free. What was I thinking in my 20’s?! *bonk bonk*
Be happy toadman1. Many men in America never see it. And no…I don’t think kids are the problem here.
-Logic 101
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